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Call for an End of Executions

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  • Gilgamesh
    replied
    As a youngster, a right-wing conservative, I was 100% pro-capital punishment. That came from a belief in the infallibility of the court system, that right always prevailed, and the naiveté of youth. I felt that anyone facing execution in our fair system could not possibly deserve it more.

    With age, I have discovered that our court system frequently fouls up, possibly as much as 20% of the time. I have found that right does not always prevail - that in fact it is more often than not trampled upon roughshod. I suppose what I am saying is that with the dissipation of my naive outlook, I have gradually become more of a pacifist and a liberal - not an extreme one, but a moderate one.

    When you take someone's life through clerical means, it is best to make damned sure you're right, since when erring to this extreme, it brings all of us down a notch each and every time it happens.

    I'm against capital punishment.

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  • thingfish
    replied
    Nah,i think killing is too quick,the bds should be made to suffer for as long as possible

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  • Nathaniel
    replied
    I probably shouldn't chuck my two cents into the forum, but that has never stoped me before, so here goes.

    I actualy suport the death penalty, in two very specific cases (and one of them has recently been brought to the fore in Oztralia)

    I think that politicians (specificaly ministers) who are found guilty of gross negligence / inompetence in an area where they should resonably have been informed and involved desearve the death penalty (Think the chinese minister for pharmacuticles who was executed of the fake/poisened drugs a year or two back)
    The other catagory is cops (high ranking only) who are found to be involved in criminal activity specificaly related to their brief. I.E. Vice squad cops found to be involved in in importation of drugs.

    These aren't realy based on reason, just apopleptic rage at the bastards who use the "I wasn't at that meeting, didn't get the memo" line, and at the gobsmaking duplicity of those entrusted with enforcing the law who break those same laws themselves

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  • thingfish
    replied
    mmm hard to tell L"etranger.
    Pretty unsettling stuff but owing to the fact that it quite finely details the botched execution attempts this may be on the side of abolishment.
    One thing for sure is that you would have to be made of stern stuff to be around when all this is going on.

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  • L'Etranger
    replied
    Now I found a site that offers sound recordings of executions in Georgia! I don't think I want to open or download one of those files, though it could be a terrific argument against death penalty.
    I don't cease to be surprised by what people come up with:
    http://soundportraits.org/on-air/exe...ete_audio.php3
    http://soundportraits.org/on-air/exe...execution.php3

    And more peculiarities: why were there two persons named Tucker Jr. executed the same day for two apparently unrelated crimes? http://soundportraits.org/on-air/exe...ast_words.php3

    Is this site ultimately promoting the abolishment of state sanctioned killing or is it there to give people weird sensations - or finally just a proud display of what recordings they got? Any ideas?

    Leave a comment:


  • Kevin McCabe
    replied
    Originally posted by TheAdlerian View Post
    According to Hans Viahinger the justice system has to maintain the fallacy of Free Will, or it would have no grounds to function.
    I need to read this guy in a big way. What's he written that I should seek?

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  • thingfish
    replied
    Oh well thats me dead then.
    I prefer Levitation.
    Bye!!

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  • David Mosley
    replied
    Originally posted by johneffay View Post
    Yes, I've noticed this which is why I advocate culling people who don't think that it's Space Ritual
    Perhaps we could replace the proposed UK ID Card system with that instead; just ask people to carry their favourite Hawkwind CD with them at all times. It'd be much cheaper as well. (Since Space Ritual is the only HW CD I own, I'll be okay. )

    Leave a comment:


  • johneffay
    replied
    Originally posted by Groakes View Post
    I guess I was thinking of the bigger, more deeply held issues, such as [...] best Hawkwind album
    Yes, I've noticed this which is why I advocate culling people who don't think that it's Space Ritual

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  • Kevin McCabe
    replied
    In private psychology, perhaps. After all, that is the sort of thing paying clients want to hear. The trend in U.S. Penal Law and in some of the more extreme forms of mental commitments are specifically centered on individual blame. The Canadian academic tract, The Psychology of Criminal Behaviour has been influential. However, even the decision to place criminality as a function of individual psyche is little more than a post-hoc rationalization. Realistically, it was introduced into a vacuum created by rejection of sociological factors as the cause of criminal action. This occurred in the late seventies. The adoption of determinate sentencing (fixed sentencing based on offense and criminal history) which rejects all forms of sociological mitigation followed in the very early eighties. This, as with many other blind policies, mark the rise of Neo-Conservatism. In it's most extreme form, we now see a significant number -perhaps a majority - of states abbrogating the defense of insanity. It is usually replaced with, guilty but mentally ill.

    Leave a comment:


  • thingfish
    replied
    Hit the nail on the head there Adlerian with your point about socialization.
    This really has to start at an early age.
    I just watched a live debate about the spiralling violence in this neck of the woods and there was much wringing of hands between the pundits and politicians but not one mention of this.
    Currently hoarse from shouting at screen
    And Groakes that was a 50/50 ball!!

    Leave a comment:


  • Groakes
    replied
    Originally posted by thingfish View Post
    Have to put my hand up here and be the first person you are aware of who has had his mind changed by internet chat room.
    Perhaps I was a bit general. We have all (I Hope) been informed by others to educate ourselves. I guess I was thinking of the bigger, more deeply held issues, such as pro life/pro choice, gun ownership, existence of god, best Hawkwind album, etc...

    I'm not saying position was tenable - and I would never countenance the reintroduction of a "Death Penalty" per se, which admittedly sounds like a major flaw and incredible hypocrisy at the centre of my position.

    And I'm not trying to draw a line on where to judge what is human, but suggesting that some acts cross that line so definitively that no other judgement is possible (Taylor's tackle on Eduardo not withstanding)

    Anyway, it's great to be here!

    Leave a comment:


  • Kevin McCabe
    replied
    TF, couldn't have said it better. If someone hurt my daughter, I wouldn't actually want Due Process. Just a knife. But, that would be me at my worst moment. WE are better than anyone at their worst.
    Groakes, sorry man, but the subjectivity to decide who is and isn't human belongs to God, if he's there. Men have never been trustworthy on the issue.
    Adlerian, sorry if that came off sharp, wasn't meant to.

    Leave a comment:


  • thingfish
    replied
    Absolutely
    I sometimes wonder how insular i must have been with my opinions before i started using this fine medium.
    To get back on topic,there was yet another call by certain parts of the British media for the return of the death penalty today
    They quoted a mother whose daughter had been brutally raped/murdered.
    Now i can totally understand this poor ladies feelings and i cant say in the heat of the moment i wouldnt feel the same but the way the press have manipulated her situation is quite sickening really.
    Needless to say it seems to be the papers of a certain Mr Murdoch who are running with this particular ball.

    Leave a comment:


  • thingfish
    replied
    Have to put my hand up here and be the first person you are aware of who has had his mind changed by internet chat room.
    In fact yer good self and Adlerian changed my opinion completely on the chemical castration idea only a few posts back
    In fact my opinion gets changed all the time here as i am not informed enough on any subject really to have carved in stone opinions and love it when somebody points out that i am being a doughball on any given subject

    Leave a comment:

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