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Israel/Lebanon Conflict (Split from 'Cyprus, Refugees...'

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  • #61
    also, we don't want to start off a chain reaction, where all old grievances in all countries are ignited again, we don't want India and Pakistan to tear each other apart, for example.

    everyone might think it time to take revenge on each other.

    "With a deep, not-unhappy sigh, Elric prepared to do battle with an army." (Red Pearls)
    - Michael Moorcock


    • #62
      Originally posted by lemec
      another worry is, (my opinion) :

      They might be in the frame of mind to feel that they would rather destroy Jerusalem than let them keep it. They might figure, if they can't have it, nobody can.

      More likely, I agree that they would hit somewhere else.
      My bitter guess would be that Jerusalem ist one of the safest places to be if you worry about nuclear terrorism. Only Mecca is holier, it at all.
      But we are actually talking as if it were all theory, there are real people out there. It is terrible.
      Last edited by L'Etranger; 07-24-2006, 08:50 AM.
      Google ergo sum


      • #63
        Originally posted by L'Etranger
        My bitter guess would be that Jerusalem ist one of the safest places to be if you worry about nuclear terrorism. Only Mecca is holier, it at all.
        But we are actually talking as if it were all theory, there are real people out there. It is terrible.

        a good point to shock us back to the reality and gravity of the situation.

        (I don't want to sound superstitious or make light of the crisis, but I did have several dreams,where I was very terrified, that a nuclear weapon detonated somewhere in the world or that my family and I were caught in it. I have been against nuclear weapons all my life, so I might just have it on my mind.)

        some motives, we can understand and hopefully prevent, but when we deal with all these unpredictable and unconventional minds, we are most frightened and we might not be able to stop those who mean other nations and their people harm.

        "With a deep, not-unhappy sigh, Elric prepared to do battle with an army." (Red Pearls)
        - Michael Moorcock


        • #64
          Originally posted by L'Etranger
          My bitter guess would be that Jerusalem ist one of the safest places to be if you worry about nuclear terrorism. Only Mecca is holier, it at all.
          But we are actually talking as if it were all theory, there are real people out there. It is terrible.
          Jeruslaem is the third holiest city to Muslims after Mecca and Medina. While I'm sure no Muslim would ever consider throwing an atom bomb on Jersualem, one thrown anywhere in Israel would affect Jerusalem in one way or another, considering Israel's small size.


          • #65
            BEIRUT, Lebanon.Israeli warplanes pounded a religious complex in a refugee-filled southern port city and other Hezbollah strongholds in Lebanon on Sunday, while the guerrillas fired rockets into northern Israel, killing at least two people.
            The strikes came a day after Israel's tanks and bulldozers barreled over the Lebanese border and its forces seized a village from the Islamic militant group.
            Hezbollah rockets badly damaged a house and slammed into a major road in Haifa, 50 kilometers (30 miles) south of the border, killing two people, and at least 13 others were wounded across northern Israel.
            Israeli Defense Minister Amir Peretz said Sunday that the 12-day-old offensive in Lebanon would continue as Israel tries to push Hezbollah guerrillas away from the border.

            BEIRUT (Reuters) - An Israeli air strike on Tuesday hit a U.N. base in southern Lebanon, killing four United Nations observers, Lebanese security sources said
            This event will sadly be slandered and propagandanized.


            • #66
              The inhabitants of Southern Lebanon have known that Hezbollah has had a strong presence in that area for the past 20 years.During media interviews, some residents even claimed to having received financial support from Hezbollah.Those same people have now become "Human Shields"(most likely unknowingly). I see no bravery in any military occupying civillian areas for a safehaven. It's a wicked war of propaganda in which both sides point at the other for a media based tabulation of casualities that the public can judge during commercials. CNN has turned tragedy into a billion dollar business ever since the Gulf War. But like any addiction it keeps you coming back for more.


              • #67
                I suggest that there are no innocents at all. Everything happens because one way or another the majority of people agree with it.
                Very difficult to achieve a state where all illusions are losts.

                People accept because they believe.... in God, in country, etc .... When you have been raised in a faith, in a nationalist ideology, in ignorance, in any ideology, to break with it is very difficult.

                And most people have faith in the governements and the press: After 21/09/2001 just a very little minority of U.S. citizens believed that Sadam Hussein was guilty. After one year of propaganda 2/3 of the U.S. citizen thought that he was gulity and that he had Massive destruction weapons.

                The solution should be education. But, for instance in some french college, some children don't want to be present to natural science or history classes because the teaching is against the beliefs of the family !


                • #68
                  Latest from the front line:

                  Israel troops 'ignored' UN plea

                  UN peacekeepers in south Lebanon contacted Israeli troops 10 times before an Israeli bomb killed four of them, an initial UN report says.

                  The post was hit by a precision-guided missile after six hours of shelling, diplomats familiar with the probe say.

                  UN-led crisis talks in Rome ended with no agreement to urge an immediate ceasefire between Israel and Hezbollah.

                  Eight Israeli soldiers have died in ongoing clashes - the biggest loss in one incident since the conflict began.

                  Twenty-two soldiers were injured as Israeli troops tried to gain control of the town of Bint Jbail, a strategically located Hezbollah stronghold.

                  Later, a massive explosion destroyed a several-storey building in the centre of Tyre housing the offices [where] a top Hezbollah commander lived.

                  He was not there at the time.

                  A senior Israel army general said he expected the fighting would continue for "several more weeks".

                  More than 400 Lebanese and 42 Israelis have died in two weeks of conflict, which began after Hezbollah captured two Israeli soldiers in a cross-border raid on 12 July.

                  In other developments:
                  • Hezbollah fired more than 100 rockets into Israel, injuring 31 people, security and medical sources say
                  • A Jordanian military plane arrived in Beirut to evacuate some of the most seriously wounded Lebanese civilians
                  • Ten lorries loaded with food and medical supplies arrived in the southern town of Tyre from the capital, Beirut
                  • Hezbollah's leader Hassan Nasrallah warned on TV that his organisation would begin firing rockets further south into Israel than Haifa
                  • More than 300 people - mainly US and Australian citizens - who had been caught in the fighting in southern Lebanon are due to leave from Tyre on a Canadian ferry on Wednesday evening
                  Israeli regrets
                  The four unarmed UN observers from Austria, Canada, China and Finland, died after their UN post in the town of Khiam was hit by an Israeli air strike on Tuesday.

                  The UN report says each time the UN contacted Israeli forces, they were assured the firing would stop.

                  A senior Irish soldier working for the UN forces had warned the Israelis six times that their bombardment was endangering the lives of UN staff, Ireland's foreign ministry said.

                  Had Israel responded to the requests, "rather than deliberately ignoring them", the observers would still be alive, a diplomat familiar with the report said.

                  Israeli Prime Minister Ehud Olmert has expressed "deep regrets" over the deaths.

                  Israel is conducting an investigation into the incident.

                  It has rejected accusations made by UN Secretary General Kofi Annan that the targeting of the UN position was "apparently deliberate".

                  White House spokesman Tony Snow said "something went really wrong" to cause the deaths, but also said there was no reason to suggest the bombing was deliberate.

                  The UN Security Council is meeting to discuss the incident.

                  'Utmost urgency'
                  The Rome summit, called by US Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice, brought together EU and Arab nations plus the US and Russia, but not Israel, Iran or Syria.

                  The conference released a declaration expressing "determination to work immediately to reach with utmost urgency a ceasefire to put an end to the current hostilities".

                  It also said a ceasefire "must be lasting, permanent and sustainable".

                  The statement called for an international force with a UN mandate for south Lebanon, and the full implementation of existing UN Security Council resolutions calling for the disarming of militias and deployment of Lebanese troops in the border region.

                  Mr Annan said it was important to work with the countries of the region, including Syria and Iran, to find a solution to the crisis.

                  But Condoleezza Rice was critical of the role of both countries.

                  "It's not a question of talking to Syria, it's whether Syria's prepared to act," she said.

                  In an impassioned speech, Lebanese Prime Minister Fouad Siniora warned that more people would die if the ceasefire was delayed, and called for a Lebanese-Israeli prisoner exchange as part of plan to end the fighting.
                  _"For an eternity Allard was alone in an icy limbo where all the colours were bright and sharp and comfortless.
                  _For another eternity Allard swam through seas without end, all green and cool and deep, where distorted creatures drifted, sometimes attacking him.
                  _And then, at last, he had reached the real world – the world he had created, where he was God and could create or destroy whatever he wished.
                  _He was supremely powerful. He told planets to destroy themselves, and they did. He created suns. Beautiful women flocked to be his. Of all men, he was the mightiest. Of all gods, he was the greatest."


                  • #69

                    and Israel expresses his regrets .......

                    that reminds me of the tears of the crocodil ............


                    • #70
                      The Ultimate Peace
                      26/07/2006 - 2:47:44 PM
                      Olmert 'deep regret' over UN peacekeeper deaths
                      Israel’s prime minister expressed “deep regret” today over the killing of UN peacekeepers in an Israeli airstrike, but rejected UN Secretary General Kofi Annan’s charge that the bombing of the UN position was apparently deliberate.
                      Four UN observers were killed in the rubble of a UN post hit by an Israeli bomb yesterday.
                      Prime Minister Ehud Olmert told Annan in a phone call today that the UN post was hit inadvertently.

                      CNN television reported that another UN peacekeeper and his wife were blown up by Israeli missiles in Tyre Lebanon today. I dont understand why Kofi Annan doesnt pull all of his people out of the range of fire instead of having them acting as "human shields" alongside Lebanese civillians. He waits until their bodies are scattered across the planes of the multiverse and then makes a "Look at what they did" statement. Get those people the F##K out of there. There is not going to be any immediate ceasefire. Israel's work in Lebanon is advantageous to the Western world, therefore the US isnt going to try and impose any stoppage in the fighting. I dont beleive that there will be any tactical changes until Hezbollah is either disarmed or disbanded. The Lebanese army started returning fire on Israeli soldiers in Lebanon, which is another point of escalation.
                      Some disturbing film footage shown today was looters in gas masks going through smoking rubble in Beirut.I guess that all species have their own forms of vermin.
                      Last edited by voilodian ghagnasdiak; 07-26-2006, 12:52 PM.


                      • #71
                        Israel's work in Lebanon is advantageous to the Western world
                        No !!!! Except from the point of view of fanatics like Bush and co.

                        We are on a powder keg, the fuse is set and we are playing with matches around .

                        In France it pours oil on social and racial tensions .

                        Globaly, it creates resentment in a big part of the world.

                        Etc ........


                        • #72
                          Do crocodiles ever kill other creatures that they do not eat for their own sustenance? Crocs only look evil. They're just trying to get by an average day in the swamp. There are no radical crocs blowing up and killing innocent crocs and provoking them to fight back and in turn proclaiming "Look What They Did".It's a war man, Kofi Annan should pull all of his people out of the range of fire.It doesnt mean what happened was not wrong but they should get all of the non military people out of the war zone. What would Churchill have done if England had been under a similar attack as the one currently staged by Hezbollah??


                          • #73
                            I dont mean to my advantage. I meant to the US government Morgan. And it is one less radical Islamic mess for the US military to contend with. None of these events should even be taking place,..but here we are.


                            • #74
                              The U.S. governement is making a primordial strategic error......

                              The blood of libanese people is the seed of new terrroist. For their resistance, Hezbollah fighters are viewed as valiant martyrs. The political benefice is for them.

                              and others things not advantageous for U.S. .


                              • #75
                                In fact in England as in Germany a maximum of not usefull civilians were pulled out of the danger zone ....... but only a little part !

                                And the bombing and the killings strengthened the will to fight of English and later of german people ........

                                Killing civilians is strategically useless and politically wrong ......

                                Whatever the true wrongs of Hezbollah does not excuse Israel attitude !

                                The tears of the crocodil is a french sentence meaning the hypocrital expression of regrets ......