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Israel/Lebanon Conflict (Split from 'Cyprus, Refugees...'

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  • #31
    Israel blames Iran for present crisis:

    Israel claims Iran link to crisis

    Hezbollah's capture of two Israeli soldiers last week was timed to divert attention from Tehran's nuclear programme, the Israeli PM has claimed.

    Ehud Olmert said that the cross-border raid in which the two soldiers were taken and eight others killed was co-ordinated with Tehran.

    About 30 people died in a seventh day of conflict, most of them in Lebanon.

    US President George W Bush has meanwhile accused Syria of trying to use the crisis to return to Lebanon.

    "Syria is trying to get back into Lebanon, it looks like to me," Mr Bush said in Washington.

    "It's essential that the government of Lebanon survives this crisis. We've worked hard to free - and we meaning the international community - worked hard to free Lebanon from Syrian influence."

    The US state department refused to confirm comments by an Israeli ambassador that Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice would travel to the region on Friday.

    Israel launched its assault and blockade last Wednesday after the two soldiers were captured.

    About 230 Lebanese people have been killed since then - the majority of them were civilians, but the toll includes about 30 soldiers. The number of Hezbollah militants killed is not known.

    Twenty-five Israelis have died - 13 civilians and 12 members of the military.

    Lebanese Shia woman who fled her country due to the Israeli bombardment cries at a makeshift refugee centre in Damascus

    Israel has frequently blamed Syria and Iran for arming and backing Hezbollah, but Mr Olmert's comments were the first explicit claim of Tehran's direct involvement in the capture of the soldiers, correspondents say.

    Mr Olmert said the timing of the incident was not an accident, and the international community at the G8 summit in Russia had fallen for it - discussing Lebanon rather than Iran's nuclear programme.

    Earlier, Israel's foreign minister met a UN team trying to negotiate a ceasefire, but said the soldiers' release and the deployment of the Lebanese army in the south would have to precede any ceasefire.

    Thousands more foreigners have continued to flee Lebanon as the crisis deepens.

    The UN announced that its non-essential staff would join the exodus.

    A British warship is currently on its way to Cyprus, carrying the first Britons to be evacuated from Lebanon by sea.

    HMS Gloucester picked up 180 of the most needy cases, including children, after docking in Beirut. Up to 5,000 more Britons are expected to follow over the next few days. The US, Canada and other governments were also organising evacuations by land, air or sea.

    In other developments:

    • Lebanese PM Fouad Siniora said Israel was "opening the gates of hell and madness" on his country, and said Israel's response to the soldiers' capture had been disproportionate
    • Pro-Syrian Lebanese President Emile Lahoud vowed to stand by Hezbollah leader Sayyed Hassan Nasrallah
    • UN Secretary General Kofi Annan said he expected European nations to contribute troops to a proposed stabilisation force to end the fighting
    • The UN warned of a humanitarian disaster as Lebanese flee their homes, with air strikes on roads and bridges hampering efforts to help them
    • Shlomo Goldwasser, the father of one of the missing Israeli soldiers, said he hoped all means - legal or illegal - would be used to get his son Ehud back
    As Israel launched fresh air strikes and cross-border attacks on Tuesday, six bodies were pulled from the rubble of a home in the Lebanese border village of Aitaroun, and another family was killed in the coastal city of Tyre.

    In one attack, 11 Lebanese soldiers were killed at a barracks east of Beirut.

    The Lebanese army has been ordered not to respond to the Israeli attacks. But Lebanese soldiers have now died in several strikes, including one on the port of Abdeh on Monday in which nine died.

    Fresh volleys of Hezbollah rockets landed on northern Israel on Tuesday. One attack killed an Israeli in the town of Nahariya.

    Rockets also hit Haifa, Safed, Acre, Kiryat Shemona, and Gush Halav region near Safed, Israeli officials told AP news agency.

    Israeli military officials say more than 700 Hezbollah rockets have now landed in Israel since the crisis began.
    http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/mid...st/5192990.stm
    _"For an eternity Allard was alone in an icy limbo where all the colours were bright and sharp and comfortless.
    _For another eternity Allard swam through seas without end, all green and cool and deep, where distorted creatures drifted, sometimes attacking him.
    _And then, at last, he had reached the real world – the world he had created, where he was God and could create or destroy whatever he wished.
    _He was supremely powerful. He told planets to destroy themselves, and they did. He created suns. Beautiful women flocked to be his. Of all men, he was the mightiest. Of all gods, he was the greatest."

    Comment


    • #32
      Originally posted by George "Dubya" Bush
      "Yo, Blair."
      Tells us everything we need to know - and indeed confirms everything we ever suspected - about the true relationship between Anthony Charles Lynton Blair and 'His Master's Voice'.
      _"For an eternity Allard was alone in an icy limbo where all the colours were bright and sharp and comfortless.
      _For another eternity Allard swam through seas without end, all green and cool and deep, where distorted creatures drifted, sometimes attacking him.
      _And then, at last, he had reached the real world – the world he had created, where he was God and could create or destroy whatever he wished.
      _He was supremely powerful. He told planets to destroy themselves, and they did. He created suns. Beautiful women flocked to be his. Of all men, he was the mightiest. Of all gods, he was the greatest."

      Comment


      • #33
        Bush: Tell her to put him on them on the spot.Thanks for (inaudbible) it's awfully thoughtful of you
        Blair: It's a pleasure
        Bush: I know you picked it out yourself
        Blair: Oh, absoultely, in fact (inaudble)
        Apparently a lot of mincing goes on these international shin-digs

        After he received the (not too expensive) shrubbery I wonder if Bush told Blair to cut down the tallest tree in the forest with a herring...
        Last edited by devilchicken; 07-18-2006, 07:03 PM.
        Batman: It's a low neighborhood, full of rumpots. They're used to curious sights, which they attribute to alcoholic delusions.

        Robin: Gosh, drink is sure a filthy thing, isn't it? I'd rather be dead than unable to trust my own eyes!

        Comment


        • #34
          IranKorea
          July 20, 2006, 3:21PM
          U.S. says Iranians witnessed North Korean missile tests

          Reuters News Service
          WASHINGTON -- One or more Iranians witnessed North Korea's recent missile tests, deepening U.S. concerns about growing ties between two countries with troubling nuclear capabilities, a top U.S. official said today.Asked at a U.S. Senate hearing about reports that Iranians witnessed the July 4 tests, Assistant Secretary of State Chris Hill, the chief U.S. negotiator with Pyongyang, replied: "Yes, that is my understanding" and it is "absolutely correct" that the relationship is worrisome.
          http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/nation/4060999.html

          Comment


          • #35
            I'd like to point you to two blogs from Lebanese people. Even if they are not impartial they are an interesting window to peoples' feelings.
            http://lebanesebloggers.blogspot.com/
            http://angryarab.blogspot.com/

            Peoples' feelings under fire. Estimates are that 500.000 people are currently on the run, the rest is in dire stress I'd guess.

            Could anyone here please check if there are fora in which Israelis and Arabs from various backgrounds encounter and exchange views? I mean if the net doesn't make a minimum of communication possible, what can?!
            Google ergo sum

            Comment


            • #36
              For instance :

              http://www.mideastweb.org/dialog.htm

              Comment


              • #37
                Merci, MK.

                Not exactly what I hoped for. At bit complicated and already too "established". I really meant a blog or forum where people from either side discussed the current situation from their "window". Something at the spur of the historic and tragic moment the humans are in.
                Google ergo sum

                Comment


                • #38
                  It would be interesting to know how the infrastructure of Cyprus is handling its sudden population explosion. Is there enough food, water and accommodations for the onslaught of escapees from Lebanon? The streets, ports and airports must be in Chaos. I would imagine that the local police have their hands full also. It would be hard to coordinate such a large scale evacuation on such short notice. The TV is constantly airing interviews of unsatisfied evacuees stating that it took too long for them to get out of Lebanon. I think the governments are doing pretty fair considering the massive scale of such an undertaking.

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    From a post on Q & A ....

                    Terrorism : if killing civilians by suicide bombing is terrorism how to name killing civilians with bombs from planes ?

                    Comment


                    • #40
                      Originally posted by Morgan Kane
                      From a post on Q & A ....

                      Terrorism : if killing civilians by suicide bombing is terrorism how to name killing civilians with bombs from planes ?
                      This statement might sound "smart" by itself. However, when put into context it completely loses its validity.

                      The only intention of suicide bombers is to specifically kill civilians and they will do everything to ensure a maximum number of civilian casualties. Israel has never targeted civilians for the sake of hurting civilians. If Israel bombs a civilian area in Lebanon it's because Hezbollah is hiding armaments there, and Israel warns the population prior to commencing the bombardment (even if that means that Hezbollah terrorists will also evacuate the area), to ensure a minimum number of civilian casualties.

                      Both Hamas and Hezbollah has adopted the horrible policy of hiding weapons within civilian population thinking that Israel would not bomb these areas, and hoping that if it does it'll get condemned worldwide. To get around this Catch 22 Israel has decided to warn civilians not to let militants hide weapons amidst them, telling them they would be held accountant if they do; and to actually bomb these weapon depots, but only after warning the population, and making sure the attacks are as accurate as possible to reduce casualties (that's one of the reasons a shipment of laser-guided missiles in now on its way from the US to Israel).

                      Can you imagine a suicide bomber entering a crowded shopping centre in Tel Aviv and asking everybody to leave the area because he's about to blow himself up in a few minutes?
                      Last edited by Oren; 07-23-2006, 03:33 AM.

                      Comment


                      • #41
                        During WW II resistants hide weapons among civilians ...... I don' t say that Hamas and Hezbollah are resistants organisations but that they see themselves as such ....

                        and allied aviation bombed towns and roads and .....

                        And when Israel bombs roads, aeroports, and so on it is to break libanon ..... even as a political move it is stupid as it reinforces arab determination !

                        These bombings are the source of new terrorism.

                        Comment


                        • #42
                          Originally posted by Morgan Kane
                          And when Israel bombs roads, aeroports, and so on it is to break libanon ..... even as a political move it is stupid as it reinforces arab determination !
                          Israel does not intend to break Lebanon but rather Hezbollah.

                          So far the Arab world hasn't been overly vocal in opposing to the Israeli operation in Lebanon. Saudi Arabia actually blamed Hezbollah of acting irresponsibly. The other option would have been to give up to Hezbollah's demands, releasing hundreds of prisoners etc. Wouldn't that actually reinforce the determination of terrorists to carry out further such operations?

                          Comment


                          • #43
                            Originally posted by Oren Douek
                            The other option would have been to give up to Hezbollah's demands, releasing hundreds of prisoners etc. Wouldn't that actually reinforce the determination of terrorists to carry out further such operations?
                            Something which, of course, Israel has never done in the past, yes?

                            Originally posted by Oren Douek
                            Israel does not intend to break Lebanon but rather Hezbollah.
                            How can you square that that with what Israel's chief of staff, Lt. Gen. Dan Halutz, told Israel's Channel 10, "If the soldiers are not returned, we will turn Lebanon's clock back 20 years."













                            "Who breaks a butterfly upon a wheel?" - Alexander Pope
                            _"For an eternity Allard was alone in an icy limbo where all the colours were bright and sharp and comfortless.
                            _For another eternity Allard swam through seas without end, all green and cool and deep, where distorted creatures drifted, sometimes attacking him.
                            _And then, at last, he had reached the real world – the world he had created, where he was God and could create or destroy whatever he wished.
                            _He was supremely powerful. He told planets to destroy themselves, and they did. He created suns. Beautiful women flocked to be his. Of all men, he was the mightiest. Of all gods, he was the greatest."

                            Comment


                            • #44
                              Originally posted by Oren Douek
                              Israel does not intend to break Lebanon but rather Hezbollah.

                              So far the Arab world hasn't been overly vocal in opposing to the Israeli operation in Lebanon. Saudi Arabia actually blamed Hezbollah of acting irresponsibly. The other option would have been to give up to Hezbollah's demands, releasing hundreds of prisoners etc. Wouldn't that actually reinforce the determination of terrorists to carry out further such operations?

                              I agree that caving in to the terrorists demands would be bad. It does encourage them,plus if the prisoners are released, they themselves might go on to kill civilians, it might even be the price of their freedom, Hezbollah would ask them to go out and bomb their enemies.

                              It is bad to involve civilians in wars, in some cases it can't be helped like in World War II. In this case, I just don't know. On one hand Israel has been a arget for so many years, you wonder why they just forget about any peace whatsoever and go after all the terrorists. On the other hand the regular people who just want to live and go about their business are being killed in the middle.

                              In The United States for instance, innocents are not held responsible for criminals, if organized crime,gangs or even domestic terrorits like the Oklahoma City bomber kill innocents, we can't go in and bomb the entire are where these criminals are from or currently live, just like we would never allow a different Nation to bomb our cities, say if a couple Americans went and killed innocent civilians of their country.

                              I they have to attack the region, they should (morally) go after Syria and Iran, the countries who aid and fund the terrorists.

                              The better way, of course, would to make an agreement with the nation's representatives and leaders to help Israel enter their countries and flush the enemies out.

                              David Mosley wrote :
                              Previously the US would have been able to urge restraint on Israel - encourage them to 'turn the other cheek' so to speak - but Bush's 'War on Terror' and his pre-emptive invasion of Iraq (supposedly as a result of 9/11) means that Israel feels confident to engage in similar tactics of its own, because sadly the US has lost any moral high-ground it once maintained.

                              True, as in the case of "Operation Desert Storm," Bush Sr. asked/pleaded Israel not to retaliate against Iraq when they were being hit by Scud missles.
                              Israel listened then, even if it took awhile to calm them down.

                              This will work vice versa, when the U.S. will say that Israel was allowed to fight and destroy the terrorists, so the U.S. should be allowed to do the same where they need to accomplish their goals. This will give Bush his "mandate" to wage war anywhere he want to, no?
                              Last edited by lemec; 07-23-2006, 06:13 AM.

                              "With a deep, not-unhappy sigh, Elric prepared to do battle with an army." (Red Pearls)
                              - Michael Moorcock

                              Comment


                              • #45
                                The photographs are very sad. (the photographer is good though, but the content is very disturbing.)

                                Another disturbing fact is that Hezbollah and other terror goups know
                                that their actions of violence will cause the deaths and maiming of the children and other citizens that they are supposed to be fighting for in the first place. -and they do not care, so long as they can kill their hated enemy.



                                It is just so upsetting. The cycle is endless.


                                That is why,maybe, terrorism might be handled best at the local levels, a highly trained police force rather than armies being unleased.

                                "With a deep, not-unhappy sigh, Elric prepared to do battle with an army." (Red Pearls)
                                - Michael Moorcock

                                Comment

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