Global what?

[Theocrat]

Re: Global what?

I just saw a story about a guy that planted a bomb at the Olympics a few years ago and attacked several abortion clinics. The guy’s name escapes me, but anyway, at his trial he stated motives for the abortion clinic bombings that were obvious but mentioned that the Olympics represented a dangerous endorsement of global socialism.

I have heard this statement from religious people ( and the like) before. What exactly is it that they don’t like about global socialism? You would think that religious people would like the idea. I can understand being against global communism if you are religious, but socialism?

My guess is that this is a manifestation of old Puritan greed mixed with religion. Your money is given to you by god and shouldn’t be shared and all that.

What are your insights?

Well hearing from the greeks when i was there about the olympics would make anyone cringe. Building new bridges and infrastructure for just having this big party and sticking the populace with the bill.
Many outrages where heard from taxidrivers and the people we met.

Many are concerned i guess that the postmodern age will lead to a neomodern one. We see the effects of that in southamerica and maybe even russia? Putin claimed that "the collapse of the Soviet Union was the biggest geopolitical catastrophe of the century".

The neoliberal wave of freedom results in an elite group of people painting themselves into a political corner. Creating more economic havoc as they go along. I'm even seeing the effects here in my country..
Government has had enough of unpaid overtime pratices and bad wages making families suffer.

What crazed Christians think i don't care. They are perhaps afraid that when a socialist government is installed people don't need religion because the state becomes the provider of welfare. And people won't come crawling to the cross anymore.

It's just a hegemonial problem involved in the issue.
What becomes God?
Church? Corporation? Or State?

[A_Non_Ymous]

Neo-feudalism in action.

Theocrat's ideas on the subject seem in the right ballpark. Historically, feudalism granted the church all sorts of benefits and exemptions with the understanding that they would minster to the social welfare needs of the poor and downtrodden -- mostly in a desire to preserve the status quo. Of course, the gross economic advantages granted the church led to them becoming absurdly wealthy, both in property and money. This is still true today. The disparity between the monarchy and church's positions of privilege versus the growing middle class in France led to the French Revolution, where the church was dispossessed. Napoleon, a few years later, realized that the church tended to back whomever was in power, as long as they were bribed appropriately, so he reinstated them to preserve his status quo.

Something of the sort seems in effect now. One thing that rankles here is that the U.S. government isn't supposed to sponser religion, yet they clearly do for their own self-serving machiavellian ends.

LSN

[Theocrat]

Neo-feudalism in action.

Theocrat's ideas on the subject seem in the right ballpark. Historically, feudalism granted the church all sorts of benefits and exemptions with the understanding that they would minster to the social welfare needs of the poor and downtrodden -- mostly in a desire to preserve the status quo. Of course, the gross economic advantages granted the church led to them becoming absurdly wealthy, both in property and money. This is still true today. The disparity between the monarchy and church's positions of privilege versus the growing middle class in France led to the French Revolution, where the church was dispossessed. Napoleon, a few years later, realized that the church tended to back whomever was in power, as long as they were bribed appropriately, so he reinstated them to preserve his status quo.

Something of the sort seems in effect now. One thing that rankles here is that the U.S. government isn't supposed to sponser religion, yet they clearly do for their own self-serving machiavellian ends.

LSN

But it's good to see that there is a counterreaction to all this. Although it's violent. I DONT want this world to fall back into a corporate-feudalistic society. With that there is no more progress.
I'd rather settle for global-socialism than the other option.
Maybe we should become a 'global social taoist society'.
Everybody would just be natural again.. Not that we would have to be running around in the forest or jungles again.
Effort and ideas are individual. And we could do what is deemed best for us to help us. Money would be a thing of the past. That is.. If we want the human race to survive?

I think humanity is really out of options.........

[Miqque]

Now, this is the kind of thing that just pisses me right off. All Christians are not a) conservative, nor b) Republican. Me, I'm a Christian pro-life Democrat what likes a strong (but not imperialistic) military and super-good health care. I do not like any coalition that speaks in the name of Jesus for political ends. Period. This lunatic killed children! He's evil, and we need to shoot him a lot (in the Christian vernacular, "send him to the judgment").

Also, I am outraged at the lot that decided to say they're Christian for the sole reason of appointing conservative judges a la George II. That lot does NOT NOT NOT speak for me (or my church, for that matter).

Jesus is so far beyond this world's fleshly politics it's not even a matter of consideration. Those who speak politics from the pulpit are not only abrogating God's Word, but they taint the rest of us who only wish to worship in peace, and give a horrid stench of money-grubbing political PACmanship that simply should not exist.

Matter o' fact, there's several laws stating that one can lose one's license for politics for the pulpit. I'll check with my pastor tonight and post the specifics.

Ooooooh, this kind of thing just lights my fuse!
:x

[Miqque]

Adlerian - What it boils down to is the bomber using all kinds of "rationale" for his own bad/evil behavior. As usual, this kind of person has no true sense of personal responsibility nor caring for others. He's just obsessed with an idea and gives in to his own dark urges. Then, when there is a socially acceptable rationale, attempts to join in with that point of view to justify unjustifiable behavior.

May be a bit more straight-forward to think of it that way than to ascribe some nobler motive.

[Theocrat]

Miqque is right!

There is nothing noble with unjustifiable behaviour..

Hitler needed some "justifible" agenda for his aggressive ideology.
We all see films about that today.

And the dictatorship was induced by the economic situation.

(Excuse me but i'm a bit drunk today! So what i write down noe is a bit outta hand somewhat!)

I had a discussion with a friend about how elitist everyone is turning in the relatively peaceful realm of Sweden. It saddens my eyes and life.
I also heard of a 'commie' acquaintance of mine flying to Cuba for a weeks vacation to "check things out". To see how things are for himself from the populace instead of the topsy-turvy media.

I'm not a 'commie' but i don't want history to end for either America or Europe. Thats why i'm so concerned. I usually vote for the right...

If there is going to be a marriage between the US and EU. I'd rather see it as a marriage between two different ideologies. NOT 'Hegemonies'.
I love americans and i don't want to see them distorted by corporations and idiot oligarchy's. Because i think Americans don't really want to be as "introverted" as they 'ought' to be by certain government officials...

There is a certain trend among the youth in Sweden (No Joke), to accept the Neocon agenda to 'trust the Corporations' that makes me sick and feel helpless. I wish Americans themselves could come to the forums and plead their case about 'Why this is wrong!'. That is.. If they want to?

I'd rather have it that european people reach their hand out to the American people than the governments or corporations doing it for us.

Americans... Europe needs your help!
If not for a semi "socialistic" world.. At least for a 'humane' one!


Democracy Now!
"By the People, For the People!"
/Jonas

[Mikey_C]

Re: Global what?

I just saw a story about a guy that planted a bomb at the Olympics a few years ago and attacked several abortion clinics. The guy’s name escapes me, but anyway, at his trial he stated motives for the abortion clinic bombings that were obvious but mentioned that the Olympics represented a dangerous endorsement of global socialism.

I'm not aware of anything 'socialist' about the Olympics - but they were certainly started with some internationalist ideals in mind. Consequently they have been used as a political football over the years and have also formed a magnet for terrorists such as when the Israeli team were kidnapped and massacred by Palestinians at Munich in 1972 (and the German government's dismal handling of this crisis brought back bad memories of the 1936 Berlin Olympics, which Hitler turned into a showcase for Nazism).

Nowadays I would say the Olympics (like everything else!) are mainly about Big Business. There is just about enough idealism left about them, though, for the textile workers' unions to build a big campaign around stopping the sweatshop labour used to make Olympics clothing and merchandise.

Overall, though, I reckon Miqque's right. This guy just wanted an excuse for a massacre. (Reminds me of a 'Not The Nine O'Clock News' sketch years ago - some Red Brigade type 'urban guerillas' sitting around a table struggling to read Das Kapital, then throw it down impatiently and say "Bugger this - let's go out and kill someone!" - or words to that effect.... :lol: )

[Miqque]

Miqque is right!

YAY!

(does Happy Dance)
:lol:

[Mikey_C]

Don't get too excited - I'm sure we'll all find something to disagree with...

[Miqque]

Don't get too excited - I'm sure we'll all find something to disagree with...

... eeep ...
8O

[Theocrat]

No, I don’t think that it is just a rationalization. Over the years I have gotten my hands on some pretty complex (and insane) Christian manifestos (complete with illustrations) about all of the things that he spoke of. Like I said, it was all about an illuminati type of force at work in the world and the whole barcode thing.

As I think about it maybe that is a code word for Jews! I have also heard a lot about global banking and all that stuff. Socialism is also associated with Jews. However, Christians ought to be associated with it too. I don’t think that American Christians think like that though.

Personally, I would find a secret organization bent on global control comforting as opposed to people voting in leaders because they are cute and tall.

Anyway, he did not make it up.

I find these things to be really tabloid and unresearched most of the time.
So what if there is a secret society out there? What are we going to do about it other than exposing it and forgetting about it. I don't really think ordinary people don't care much, and if they do, they resort to idle or ideal speculation. Bush is the dummest anti-christ if i've ever seen one..

I'd rather have it that european people reach their hand out to the American people than the governments or corporations doing it for us.

Americans... Europe needs your help!
If not for a semi "socialistic" world.. At least for a 'humane' one!

Man.... I do sound bleedy when i get sloshed on whiskey and coke... :lol: Well... At least on the net..
And talking about 'Coke' everyone!:
http://www.killercoke.org/

I'm not touching the stuff anymore!

[Theocrat]

I was always amused/scared by the fear that bar codes caused in the early 90s. Computers also scared people. I recall that people thought that computers could “do� things or “know� things. Perhaps when people watched a bar code being scanned they felt as if they were watching some sort of magic. Anyway, there was a lot of talk about it amongst certain religious groups.

Same thing here about "microchips"?
It's not surprising that religious people are the most easy to scare since they are so sensitive to how free or progressive society can become.
Think of the way communism is viewed by religious people. Calling it "Devilism" for some obscure reason. Although there are religious communists. Or so i've heard?

Additionally, the abortion issue does walk a fine line with murder and I can only imagine the mind of a person that sees it clearly as murder. Most of us don’t see it as murder and will vigorously argue that it is not. To the religiously/conspiratorial minded it must seem as if we all are in some mass delusional brainwashing program.

Doh! Wasn't it the "Arch-Conservative Wedge" who banned condome machines around dorms. And still claiming "abstinence is best!".
And then being against abortion?
Doesn't sound like they are being realistic there!

I think the kids in our schools are being brainwashed to love neoliberalism. It has been so said by teachers who skip around universities i think it was? (my grammar is starting to suck!)

All of this stuff must build up in people until they decide to take action. So, I don believe that they have a rationale, but it is not good enough to start blowing people up.

Thing is... There are plenty of people willing to do just that..

I think those in power need to talk more to the people about what is going on. And thats why i think upper echelon idiots need to climb down from their high ladders to listen and talk with the populace, office people, workers. So that they don't spread fear or paranoia.
I don't think Socialism alone could do that. I think it's needed at a relational level and compromises could be done to stop disasters from continually happening.

Maybe we need a 'therapist state'. (Social-Therapism?) "Power to the Therapists!"
And "For the people, by the therapists!".. :)

[Mikey_C]

Bar codes - how quaint! :roll: They won't be needed: http://www.georgeorwell.org.uk/

And 8O a 'Therapist State' ! This would be my nightmare. .. neurosis is a human right Seriously, though - bad things would happen...

[Theocrat]

Bar codes - how quaint! :roll: They won't be needed: http://www.georgeorwell.org.uk/

And 8O a 'Therapist State' ! This would be my nightmare. .. neurosis is a human right Seriously, though - bad things would happen...

It was a joke man!.. :lol:

Ever heard about "Technocracy Inc."
Sounds creepy as well..
But they seem well intentioned to global needs..
http://www.technocracyinc.org

[Miqque]

Barcodes. Pah. Computers. Pah. Microchips. Pah.

Now, them barcoded computer-read by microchips cards we have to get to get decent prices at the supermarket - now those worry me a bit. (And, NO, dammit, I don't want to buy some Ensure or Sun-Dried Tomatoes!)

And it is no longer the Illuminati that are a problem (the Masons ate 'em); but Skull & Bones. And maybe the Faith for the Family (or whatever it's called) nonsense. Nothing more frightening than any form of government hiding under the mask of theocracy. Inquisitions and such, y'know.

And The Da Vinci Code and NBC's Revelations are hokum, too, BTW. Just thought I'd mention that.