Announcement

Collapse

Welcome to Moorcock's Miscellany

Dear reader,

Many people have given their valuable time to create a website for the pleasure of posing questions to Michael Moorcock, meeting people from around the world, and mining the site for information. Please follow one of the links above to learn more about the site.

Thank you,
Reinart der Fuchs
See more
See less

New Dune Movie (2021?) and assorted melange

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts
  • EverKing
    Eternal Companion
    • Jan 2004
    • 947

    #16
    It is released Stateside late tomorrow night (10/22). I have family obligations this weekend so don't think I'll get to it right away but next week I should be able to hit it in IMAX.

    I haven't read any other reviews of it since those first early impressions so am going in open minded. I remain cautiously optimistic.
    "In omnibus requiem quaesivi, et nusquam inveni nisi in angulo cum libro"
    --Thomas a Kempis

    Comment

    • zlogdan
      Hex data reader and professional pawn
      • Mar 2012
      • 1930

      #17
      I saw it yesterday. It is excellent. I had decided to watch and ignore all the criticisms made to the book by the director.
      "From time to time I demonstrate the inconceivable, or mock the innocent, or give truth to liars, or shred the poses of virtue.(...) Now I am silent; this is my mood." From Sundrun's Garden, Jack Vance.
      "As the Greeks have created the Olympus based upon their own image and resemblance, we have created Gotham City and Metropolis and all these galaxies so similar to the corporate world, manipulative, ruthless and well paid, that conceived them." Braulio Tavares.

      Comment

      • Navigator
        Chaos Engineer
        • Jun 2010
        • 111

        #18
        I absolutely loved it. As expected, it was visually stunning, but the score blew me away. It was beautiful and intense. Of course there were some differences and deviations from the book, but ever since the first LOTR movie I have learned to accept that a screenplay is not the same as literature.
        The one thing that jumped out at me is how quickly and definitively the messiah plot was introduced. It was more subtle in the book until later. But I think it was necessary to seed the idea from early on in movie form.
        I saw it with my children and wife. All of us have read it and everyone loved the film.
        I am curious to know how it was for people who had never read the book. Was it easy to follow? Was it confusing? Probably not going to get answers to these questions in this forum.
        I have seen that the next film has been given the green light!!
        I('d) tell you all, we are young at the end of this cycle, and there may be no rest even when we are done.- Devin Townsend

        Comment

        • zlogdan
          Hex data reader and professional pawn
          • Mar 2012
          • 1930

          #19
          Originally posted by Navigator View Post
          I absolutely loved it. As expected, it was visually stunning, but the score blew me away. It was beautiful and intense. Of course there were some differences and deviations from the book, but ever since the first LOTR movie I have learned to accept that a screenplay is not the same as literature.
          The one thing that jumped out at me is how quickly and definitively the messiah plot was introduced. It was more subtle in the book until later. But I think it was necessary to seed the idea from early on in movie form.
          I saw it with my children and wife. All of us have read it and everyone loved the film.
          I am curious to know how it was for people who had never read the book. Was it easy to follow? Was it confusing? Probably not going to get answers to these questions in this forum.
          I have seen that the next film has been given the green light!!
          The more I think about the film the more I like it. I loved the languages they created for the film. The Sarkaudar and the Harkonens speak in a very guttural way. Also while the Sarkaudar are preparing for war there is some throat singing, which I initially thought would imply they had Mongolian roots but I have seen throat singing is also common in Scandinavia. Thank God they will do a sequel.
          "From time to time I demonstrate the inconceivable, or mock the innocent, or give truth to liars, or shred the poses of virtue.(...) Now I am silent; this is my mood." From Sundrun's Garden, Jack Vance.
          "As the Greeks have created the Olympus based upon their own image and resemblance, we have created Gotham City and Metropolis and all these galaxies so similar to the corporate world, manipulative, ruthless and well paid, that conceived them." Braulio Tavares.

          Comment

          • EverKing
            Eternal Companion
            • Jan 2004
            • 947

            #20
            Work and Family have been keeping from seeing it as yet. I was originally hoping to catch it this past weekend but something came up. Now it is looking like it may be another two weeks before I get the chance.
            "In omnibus requiem quaesivi, et nusquam inveni nisi in angulo cum libro"
            --Thomas a Kempis

            Comment

            • Heresiologist
              Mothra Worshipper
              • Jan 2012
              • 1006

              #21
              Originally posted by Navigator View Post
              ...I am curious to know how it was for people who had never read the book. Was it easy to follow? Was it confusing? Probably not going to get answers to these questions in this forum.
              A friend of mine told me he had to do some explaining to his wife and daughter after seeing the movie. Personally, I'd be more surprised if that wasn't the case. Book's got a lot going on.

              Comment

              • Heresiologist
                Mothra Worshipper
                • Jan 2012
                • 1006

                #22
                Originally posted by EverKing View Post
                Work and Family have been keeping from seeing it as yet. I was originally hoping to catch it this past weekend but something came up. Now it is looking like it may be another two weeks before I get the chance.
                The worker must vacation ;)

                Comment

                • EverKing
                  Eternal Companion
                  • Jan 2004
                  • 947

                  #23
                  I was able to get to it in the cinema this past weekend with my Mrs. and step-son.
                  Originally posted by Heresiologist View Post

                  A friend of mine told me he had to do some explaining to his wife and daughter after seeing the movie. Personally, I'd be more surprised if that wasn't the case. Book's got a lot going on.
                  I had to do the same. My Step-Son, I think, was underwhelmed because it wasn't fast and mindless like Marvel and he struggled to understand it. My Mrs, on the other hand was impressed but it wasn't until we came home and watched it a second time on HBO Max that she really started to appreciate all that was going on with it.

                  I was impressed with the design of it: set design, costume, sound design. I absolutely loved the interpretation of the 'Thopters as resembling dragonflies. The cinematography was not what I expected but was very well done and effective; it was far more personal rather than long and epic through most of it but I think that served the personal nature of the story well. The acting, I felt, was knocked out of the park by everyone involved. Rebecca Fergusson (as Lady Jessica) was incredible even if there were times I felt she displayed too much instability and emotion for a Bene Gesserit--yet even that worked in the context of being a visual display of her inner feelings and fears. Timothee Chalumet (as Paul) was the best Paul we've gotten and I thought he nailed it pretty well. I really liked the way the 'Gom Jabbar' scene was handled with Jessica audibly reciting the Litany Against Fear and cutting back to Paul to see him calming himself at pace with her--showing he was also using the Litany internally without the David Lynch whispered internal monologue.

                  I also especially liked the way Paul's visions are imprecise and more symbolic than literal. The vision of Jamis telling him he will teach him the ways of the desert, for example, really drove home the importance of the act the follow. I was sad that they fought under Amtal in their Stillsuits, it would have been an easy thing to have them fight without and explain why.

                  The only things that disappointed me was the dropping of some of the other plot lines such as Paul being trained as a Mentat (something I always thought was extremely important to understanding his character) and the lack of the "traitor" question. As part of that, I was sad that Gurney, Thufir, and Yueh had so little to do and such little screen time--you really don't get a sense of how important they all are to the build-up and to Paul's character.

                  I plan on watching it a few more times before it leaves HBO. I know there are things I missed. Overall, I give it a solid 9/10.
                  "In omnibus requiem quaesivi, et nusquam inveni nisi in angulo cum libro"
                  --Thomas a Kempis

                  Comment

                  • zlogdan
                    Hex data reader and professional pawn
                    • Mar 2012
                    • 1930

                    #24
                    Originally posted by EverKing View Post
                    I was able to get to it in the cinema this past weekend with my Mrs. and step-son.

                    I plan on watching it a few more times before it leaves HBO. I know there are things I missed. Overall, I give it a solid 9/10.
                    HBO max is promoting this film for the end of the month ( it is HBO max for Brazil everything limited and delayed ) but how much did you have to pay to watch it ? I really want to buy the digital film in HD when it comes out. For me, it was a 10//10, probably one of my all-time favorite films.

                    "From time to time I demonstrate the inconceivable, or mock the innocent, or give truth to liars, or shred the poses of virtue.(...) Now I am silent; this is my mood." From Sundrun's Garden, Jack Vance.
                    "As the Greeks have created the Olympus based upon their own image and resemblance, we have created Gotham City and Metropolis and all these galaxies so similar to the corporate world, manipulative, ruthless and well paid, that conceived them." Braulio Tavares.

                    Comment

                    • EverKing
                      Eternal Companion
                      • Jan 2004
                      • 947

                      #25
                      Originally posted by zlogdan View Post

                      HBO max is promoting this film for the end of the month ( it is HBO max for Brazil everything limited and delayed ) but how much did you have to pay to watch it ? I really want to buy the digital film in HD when it comes out. For me, it was a 10//10, probably one of my all-time favorite films.
                      It was included in my Max membership, so it had no additional cost to watch it. At least until the 22-Nov when it will be dropped off the service.

                      As for my 9/10 rating...I can't think of a single film I would ever have given 10/10 although this comes damn close. Really more of a 9.8/10 if I wanted to get picky. The only things holding it back from 10/10 are those few items I mentioned above: no exploration of Paul's Mentat training (which leads to lack of Thufir screen time) and no traitor sub-plot (leading to lack of time for Gurney and Yueh...and to a lesser extant Piter De Vries). Regardless, this is already in my top 5 (maybe top 3?) and has potential to hit #1; I just need to watch it a few more times to really absorb it all.

                      What I have loved most about the experience so far is talking to my wife about it and her slowly coming around to just how complex much of it is. She doesn't want "spoilers" (even though she's sat through the Lynch version with me and even started the SciFi/SyFy version) so until Part 2 comes out I can't really get into the deeper threads too much but even explaining how the Voice works--that it is not supernatural but psychological--and talking about the social manipulations hidden in the story has made her far more interested in Dune than she ever was before. I love being able to share this with her.

                      Now...if we could only get an interconnected MM Multiverse series going...
                      "In omnibus requiem quaesivi, et nusquam inveni nisi in angulo cum libro"
                      --Thomas a Kempis

                      Comment

                      • zlogdan
                        Hex data reader and professional pawn
                        • Mar 2012
                        • 1930

                        #26
                        Originally posted by EverKing View Post

                        It was included in my Max membership, so it had no additional cost to watch it. At least until the 22-Nov when it will be dropped off the service.

                        As for my 9/10 rating...I can't think of a single film I would ever have given 10/10 although this comes damn close. Really more of a 9.8/10 if I wanted to get picky. The only things holding it back from 10/10 are those few items I mentioned above: no exploration of Paul's Mentat training (which leads to lack of Thufir screen time) and no traitor sub-plot (leading to lack of time for Gurney and Yueh...and to a lesser extant Piter De Vries). Regardless, this is already in my top 5 (maybe top 3?) and has potential to hit #1; I just need to watch it a few more times to really absorb it all.

                        What I have loved most about the experience so far is talking to my wife about it and her slowly coming around to just how complex much of it is. She doesn't want "spoilers" (even though she's sat through the Lynch version with me and even started the SciFi/SyFy version) so until Part 2 comes out I can't really get into the deeper threads too much but even explaining how the Voice works--that it is not supernatural but psychological--and talking about the social manipulations hidden in the story has made her far more interested in Dune than she ever was before. I love being able to share this with her.

                        Now...if we could only get an interconnected MM Multiverse series going...
                        In the past, HBO has charged around 60 reais ( ~9 dollars ) for Wonder Woman 2, Suicide Squad so did Disney. Hopefully, we will get it free too on November 25th.
                        I liked the film so much that has gotten me interested again in the Dune universe. It was 1993 when I read Emperor God Of Dune and I did not like it at all but I am reading the 5th book now.

                        "From time to time I demonstrate the inconceivable, or mock the innocent, or give truth to liars, or shred the poses of virtue.(...) Now I am silent; this is my mood." From Sundrun's Garden, Jack Vance.
                        "As the Greeks have created the Olympus based upon their own image and resemblance, we have created Gotham City and Metropolis and all these galaxies so similar to the corporate world, manipulative, ruthless and well paid, that conceived them." Braulio Tavares.

                        Comment

                        • EverKing
                          Eternal Companion
                          • Jan 2004
                          • 947

                          #27
                          The core Dune saga really breaks down in the second half, in my opinion. God Emperor, Heretics, and Chapterhouse—while interesting in their own right—don’t quite hold up the first three. I haven’t yet read any of Brian Herbert’s expanded Dune prequels or sequels so can’t speak to them.
                          "In omnibus requiem quaesivi, et nusquam inveni nisi in angulo cum libro"
                          --Thomas a Kempis

                          Comment

                          • zlogdan
                            Hex data reader and professional pawn
                            • Mar 2012
                            • 1930

                            #28
                            Originally posted by EverKing View Post
                            The core Dune saga really breaks down in the second half, in my opinion. God Emperor, Heretics, and Chapterhouse—while interesting in their own right—don’t quite hold up the first three. I haven’t yet read any of Brian Herbert’s expanded Dune prequels or sequels so can’t speak to them.
                            I am enjoying Heretics a lot. Maybe I was disappointed that God Emperor takes place 1500 years after book 3. But I struggled to read it.
                            "From time to time I demonstrate the inconceivable, or mock the innocent, or give truth to liars, or shred the poses of virtue.(...) Now I am silent; this is my mood." From Sundrun's Garden, Jack Vance.
                            "As the Greeks have created the Olympus based upon their own image and resemblance, we have created Gotham City and Metropolis and all these galaxies so similar to the corporate world, manipulative, ruthless and well paid, that conceived them." Braulio Tavares.

                            Comment

                            • Heresiologist
                              Mothra Worshipper
                              • Jan 2012
                              • 1006

                              #29
                              Originally posted by EverKing View Post
                              I was able to get to it in the cinema this past weekend with my Mrs. and step-son.

                              I had to do the same. My Step-Son, I think, was underwhelmed because it wasn't fast and mindless like Marvel and he struggled to understand it. My Mrs, on the other hand was impressed but it wasn't until we came home and watched it a second time on HBO Max that she really started to appreciate all that was going on with it.
                              ...
                              My daughter liked it. I guess she was happy to just go with the Chalemet flow and wait for Zendaya's big entrance. Right after leaving the theatre, I asked her if there was anything that confused her and she said no. Nevertheless, I did end up giving her some Lynchian info-dumps on the Bene Gesserit, the voice, mentats, why spitting was a sign of Fremen respect etc. all of which she seemed to appreciate.

                              I think the rest of your points about the film are on point, but it's more of a 7.5/10 show for me. Everything looks great and right, but somehow the sum is less than the parts. This seems to be the long and short of all three Villeneuve films I've seen. I think he's on the verge of greatness, technically he's there, but something just doesn't gel for me. Still, I'm glad he's doing what he's doing, especially his desire to make it a trilogy with the 3rd film covering Dune Messiah. Guy seems a genuine Dune superfan.

                              Comment

                              Working...
                              X