Announcement

Collapse

Welcome to Moorcock's Miscellany

Dear reader,

Many people have given their valuable time to create a website for the pleasure of posing questions to Michael Moorcock, meeting people from around the world, and mining the site for information. Please follow one of the links above to learn more about the site.

Thank you,
Reinart der Fuchs
See more
See less

Star War(t)s

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Star War(t)s

    I make no secret of the fact that I dislike the Lucas Star War(t)s extravaganzas. Now, it appears that my research group is going to be "rewarded" by taking us to the bloody movie when it opens here. I must have been unusually bad. Thus, is my perfect record spoiled: I saw the first 3 films in the series, but haven't seen the last 2 films, and have had no intention of doing so. I didn't like the first 3, and saw no reason to punish myself further, helpful friends to the contrary. :lol:

    If I hear anyone say, "Que la Force soit avec toi," I think I'll jump out the window.

    I date the final collapse of the New Wave in sf from the advent of the first Star War(t)s movie. It doesn't bring back fond memories. I recall a friend back in the '70s who coaxed me to go along with a gang of other friends to the first movie Lucas made in the series. I was not amused. As we left the theater, basking in the glow of that immortal story, my friend reflected, "The story line is so simple it's hypnotic." "Yes," I replied, "like a sedative."

    I am, no doubt, being cranky on this subject. This is a subjective response to the films. There are almost certainly those on MWM who actually like the films, to whom I say, more power to you. (Or should that be "Force" instead of "power"?) :lol:

    LSN

  • #2
    There was a story line? :?

    Whilst I run the risk of accusations of hypocrisy as I still have my original Star Wars bubble gum cards somewhere, I find the mawkishness of the series literally toe-curling. Although the dreadfully 'seventies-American name of 'Skywalker' is bad enough, poor Lukey-babe's original monicker, 'Starkiller', reveals the gloopy pap from which the series was conceived: glitterball SF and Cosmic westerns of the pulpiest pulpiness ever pulped. A dreadful genesis, the cod-philosophical core of which gains no patina of conviction with the passing years. If anything, the second 'wave' of SW takes the cheesiness to new levels of rankness. After all, CGI or no, you can't polish a turd.

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by Perdix
      ... After all, CGI or no, you can't polish a turd.
      :lol: There's going to be white plastic, Empire Storm Troopers on your tail for that one, Perdix! :lol:

      Comment


      • #4
        Well, I must admit to liking the original trilogy, despite the banality and mawkishness. As Alec Guinesss reportedly said to Harrison Ford, "Mark you. This film will have distinction." For good or ill they had a tremedous impact on movie sf and fantasy... without Star Wars, would there be (the prospect of) an Elric movie? I'm not sure about their impact on written sf... I think the New Wave had broken anyway. (Which touches on [broken link]this Q&A thread.)

        But the prequels... bubblegum for the mind. And like some sweets (candies!), they leave a bitter aftertaste. I'm firmly with Simon Pegg on this!

        But... has anyone noticed the similarities between Star Wars and M. John Harrison's The Pastel City? Several of the motifs in the novel crop up, particularly in the new sequence: the young queen (Methvet Nian, Queen Jane v. Padmأ© Naberrie, Queen Amidala), the brotherhood of knights (Methven v. Jedi), and the energy blades (baan v. light sabre). Quite ironic, given the stylistic gulf between them…

        Gr.,
        Ant
        Last edited by Rothgo; 04-09-2010, 12:07 PM.

        Comment


        • #5
          Well, I felt very guilty about apparently killing (or at least severely wounding) the SW thread in the movie section, so now I'll just cower behind LSN and go "Yeah!" when he makes a point I agree with.

          I was dragged along to see the "re-mastered" versions when they were released at the cinema with fancy new CGI, but up unhtil then I'd managed to avoid them all, no matter how many times they were shown on TV at X-Mas. This means that I have no nostalgic attachment to the series, sadly.

          Still, it's worth pointing out that I own and enjoy far worse movies in the privacy of my own bedroom, so I'm really not in any position to judge.

          Dee,

          aka Brown Crow

          Comment


          • #6
            Feeble Star Wars Joke:

            Luke and his Old Man, Darth Vader, are having a luminous-stick set to on Cloud City or somewhere. As their shimmering blades lock (Oedipus or what?) Luke's sweating fizzog comes into close contact with his pop's black grill:

            Vader: Huurrrrr.....Luke, I know what you're getting for Christmassss...

            Luke: 'No! How can you know what I'm getting for Christmas?'

            >Bzzzt! Flash! Schwing! Bzzt (imagine the action, please)<

            V: [b]Hccch...Luke, I KNOW what you're getting for Chrissstmasss...'
            L: 'But how can you know what I'm getting for Chrismas?'

            >Fzzzt! Schwang!<

            V: 'I KNOW what you're getting for Christmassss...hurggh..'

            L: 'But Howwww?'

            >Fschzzzt!<

            V: 'Luke...hhh..I felt your presents...'

            Think about it.

            Comment


            • #7
              But not fot too long

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by Ant
                As Alec Guinesss reportedly said to Harrison Ford, "Mark you. This film will have distinction."
                I read somewhere that he actually asked Lucas to kill the Kenobi character so he could stop spouting awful dialogue and pseudo-mysticism. He didn't realise that George would make him a ghost and have him return for another two films.

                AND he must have recognised the "distinction" early on as he negotiated himself 2% of the gross instead of a straight fee. I imagine the income from that must have helped him get through the awful dialogue.

                Comment


                • #9
                  I don't get it, Perdix... Please explain.... Har har har har....

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    True confession time...

                    I loved the original film. It was the first movie I saw twice. I think I was seven years old.

                    I liked the second one a lot, too. I think I was 10 when I saw it.

                    The act had worn thin by the third one, and I was massively disappointed. I think I had outgrown it.

                    Now Lucas makes me yawn. The dialogue in the clips is enough to keep me from wasting my hard-earned $10. I have to feel a little bad for Ewen McGregor, Sam Jackson, and Natalie Portman--what are good actors doing in a movie where they are asked to do no more than pose and deliver cheesy dialogue? If I want to see that, I'll watch David Caruso on CSI:Miami (which also makes me sick, for the record).

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Ant
                      But... has anyone noticed the similarities between Star Wars and M. John Harrison's The Pastel City? Several of the motifs in the novel crop up, particularly in the new sequence: the young queen (Methvet Nian, Queen Jane v. Padmأ© Naberrie, Queen Amidala), the brotherhood of knights (Methven v. Jedi), and the energy blades (baan v. light sabre). Quite ironic, given the stylistic gulf between them…

                      Gr.,
                      Ant
                      Yes I've often thought this. I'm quite determined that JL has purloined, subconciously if not consciously, much from the Pastel City. JL claims a strong influence from Joseph Campbell so it's likely that Luke Skywalker in Eps 4-6 was designed as a pop sci-fi version of the archetypal hero in Campbells Hero With a Thousand Faces.

                      I quite enjoy the Star Wars series of films, esp the concept of a 'noble' protector-of-the-people style Jedi order, but for me it has been eclipsed by stuff like Firefly among others. I do get put off by the mega-hype and uber-merchandising surrounding Star Wars though and am a little annoyed that the (bound to be dramatically superior) Firefly movie 'Serenity' has been delayed until September to avoid getting overshadowed by the release of EP 3.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        A list of Lucas' influences would be enormous. IMHO it's more evidence of his creative bankruptcy.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          I happen to think the critics are a little hard on poor old Lucas (Well, OK, he's not poor) as I very much enjoyed the first trilogy. For me, it was the special effects--the dumb names and lame dialogue aside--that really made these movies stand out from the herd. To a lesser extent, I've followed along with the next two, more for the sense of completion than anything else and I will be going to see 'Sith' but I certainly won't be lining up for the privilege of being able to do so.

                          I think they beat LOTR hands down any event!!

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            I recall that when the first three movies started showing as triple-bill all-nighters, my contingent of stoner friends would go along and experience them while ripped to the tits on various recreational chemicals. Apparently it improved them no end.

                            What I remember with sadness about the very first SW movie was that it was the first film I ever saw that was obviously coasting by on minimal character development. SF movies in general have gone that way ever since, I think.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Out of the original trilogy, I only enjoyed the second one. Not a dull moment and it was a nice thrill ride for the time, with even an old fashioned cliffhanger.

                              But I loathe Lucas. He rapes his fans over and over again. New sound, new crappy cgi effects, look buy the new box set for a new trailer! Over and over again, and the fans (fantatics all) keep letting themselves be raped by supporting him and buying into each new and improved thing. And now the theatrical originals are nonexistant, and you have to buy the box set, all or nothing. I otped for nothing. The first was all LOTR's desert wasteland slow, and the had insipid muppets in them.

                              Even though I'm a big John Ostrander and Jan Dursema fan, I will not buy their Star Wars comics because... I loathe Star Wars and Lucas.

                              If I were forced to watch one Lucas film, I'd rather watch THX 1138 (or whatever it was called). Great film.

                              SW? Nope. Never again.

                              Jeff

                              Comment

                              Working...
                              X