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Multiverse (by David Weber)

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  • Multiverse (by David Weber)

    A new series
    Last edited by Krzysiek; 05-16-2008, 02:49 PM.

  • #2
    Any relationship with the Hell serie of the end of the eighties by many authors, the most foremost being Cherryh ?

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heroes_in_Hell

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    • #3
      Originally posted by Morgan Kane
      Any relationship with the Hell serie of the end of the eighties by many authors, the most foremost being Cherryh ?
      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heroes_in_Hell
      Strange question...
      I thought you'd rather be surprised with the title "Multiverse", used by authors as a marketing trick. Seems it didn't strike anybody but me.

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      • #4
        I would be very annoyed if somebody used a term I coined to promote other stuff, regardless of its quality. But can MM really protect a word that has become a generic term outside his creations?
        Google ergo sum

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        • #5
          Mike never actually coined the word 'multiverse'; what he did was to embue the term with a meaning that prior to 1962 (and publication of The Sundered Worlds/The Blood-Red Game) it hadn't had before.

          Krzysiek may remember this thread from 2004 which discusses that 'Multiverse' is apparently a trademark of WotC, and was the reason why Tiskele Games renamed their miniatures battle game from 'Multiverse' to 'Aetherverse'.

          Here's Mike's comment at the time about calling things 'Multiverse-something-or-other' (empahsis mine):

          Originally posted by Michael Moorcock
          Michael Moorcock's Multiverse is an established title and Multiverse Inc is the name of my company. I haven't pursued use of the multiverse because technically it isn't my title -- that is I first used it to mean a number of alternate universes, but William James was probably the first person to use the word. Since I used it, many others have used it to describe -- well, the multiverse. As long as there is no intention of passing off something as mine, I have long felt that the name, together with things like the Chaos symbol have passed into wider currency. However, if anyone else tried to trademark the name, I would then challenge them. I don't believe it is possible to trademark a word which is now, for instance, in the Oxford English Dictionary! However it is possible to trademark something like Michael Moorcock's Multiverse or Multiverse Game of Blah Blah -- i.e. something that is specific, but doesn't try to trademark a word now in common currency. Equally I should take umbridge at someone trying to establish the Chaos symbol as their ownership. Only then would I step in and take legal action.

          However if you wished to call something 'John Smith's Multiverse' you would have no problem.
          _"For an eternity Allard was alone in an icy limbo where all the colours were bright and sharp and comfortless.
          _For another eternity Allard swam through seas without end, all green and cool and deep, where distorted creatures drifted, sometimes attacking him.
          _And then, at last, he had reached the real world – the world he had created, where he was God and could create or destroy whatever he wished.
          _He was supremely powerful. He told planets to destroy themselves, and they did. He created suns. Beautiful women flocked to be his. Of all men, he was the mightiest. Of all gods, he was the greatest."

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          • #6
            Oh yes, now I remember that thread. This case is quite similar, don't you think? There are only two things I cannot undertstand.

            1) Two years ago Michael claimed to sue anyone for trying to trademark the name "Multiverse". But AFAIK, at that time the name was already trademarked by WotC! So what's with the promissed trial?

            2) Since "Multiverse" is a trademark of WotC, why WotC forced Tiskele to change the name of the game, but allowed Michael to use the very same name as a title of his comics? Does it mean there's a non-aggression pact between MM and WotC?

            Besides, the difference between "Multiverse" and "Michael Moorcock's Multiverse" is not bigger than between e.g. "Star Wars" and "Michael Moorcock's Star Wars". I'm not a lawyer, so forgive me my silly questions...
            Last edited by Krzysiek; 12-11-2006, 02:29 AM.

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            • #7
              A use of the term 'multiverse' that has a greater sense of resonance with MM's creation may be that of www.multiverse.net: a system for the development / running of many multi-user online universes, all active at the same time from the same servers.
              Will somebody create a black <object, typically pointy> and start running from universe one to the next? Who knows...

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              • #8
                Originally posted by Krzysiek
                1) Two years ago Michael claimed to sue anyone for trying to trademark the name "Multiverse". But AFAIK, at that time the name was already trademarked by WotC! So what's with the promissed trial?

                2) Since "Multiverse" is a trademark of WotC, why WotC forced Tiskele to change the name of the game, but allowed Michael to use the very same name as a title of his comics? Does it mean there's a non-aggression pact between MM and WotC?
                That's one (or two) for Mike really. With the caveat that 'I'm not a (copyright/trademark) lawyer', I'm not sure if it's really possible to trademark specific words, like - in this case - 'Multiverse' anymore than you could (presumably) trademark 'Universe'. That doesn't necessarily stop WotC from applying for - and receiving - a trademark for their Multiverse expansion to MTG, but if challenged I'm not sure that they could prove that it
                "is a distinctive sign of some kind which is used by an organization to uniquely identify itself and its products and services to consumers, and to distinguish the organization and its products or services from those of other organizations"
                This Wiki article (from which that quote is taken) may be of interest: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trademarks
                _"For an eternity Allard was alone in an icy limbo where all the colours were bright and sharp and comfortless.
                _For another eternity Allard swam through seas without end, all green and cool and deep, where distorted creatures drifted, sometimes attacking him.
                _And then, at last, he had reached the real world – the world he had created, where he was God and could create or destroy whatever he wished.
                _He was supremely powerful. He told planets to destroy themselves, and they did. He created suns. Beautiful women flocked to be his. Of all men, he was the mightiest. Of all gods, he was the greatest."

                Comment


                • #9
                  Wikipedia says:
                  The mark may only be inherently registrable if the consumer has never encountered the mark before.
                  Then how could WotC trademark "Multiverse", if this term has been widely known before, recognizable and associated (almost exclusively) with Michael Moorcock's novels? Could WotC have concealed it from the Trademark Office?
                  Last edited by Krzysiek; 12-11-2006, 05:36 AM.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    I suspect this is what is known as 'chancing your arm'.

                    WOTC/Hasbro is a extremely large multinational corporation so if they thought they could get away with it, it wouldn't surprise me if they didn't just submit a whole wodge of 'trademarks' - including 'Multiverse' - to the US Trademarks Office and just got a 'rubber stamp' on them. My (limited/layman's) understanding is that Trademark Office probably doesn't have the resources (or inclination?) to check whether a registee has a 'right' to trademark a word, name, phrase, etc. - instead it's up to other interested parties to contest the right of the registee to own the trademark after its been assigned.

                    For instance, I could presumably go and trademark the name 'Krzysiek' if I wanted to - it doesn't automatically follow (afaik) that it would be legally enforceable if you chose to contest it.
                    _"For an eternity Allard was alone in an icy limbo where all the colours were bright and sharp and comfortless.
                    _For another eternity Allard swam through seas without end, all green and cool and deep, where distorted creatures drifted, sometimes attacking him.
                    _And then, at last, he had reached the real world – the world he had created, where he was God and could create or destroy whatever he wished.
                    _He was supremely powerful. He told planets to destroy themselves, and they did. He created suns. Beautiful women flocked to be his. Of all men, he was the mightiest. Of all gods, he was the greatest."

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      It seems that trademarks are meant to discourage other players, rather than to prevent them effectively from using certain names or symbols. As you said, WotC is a big company, powerful enough to trademark whatever they want and then hire the best lawyers to protect their (just or not) rights. Who can afford to challenge them?
                      Last edited by Krzysiek; 12-11-2006, 06:04 AM.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        William James, early adopter and probably creator of the word Multiverse (Mike says) is also a favourite author of Daniel Dennett. Coincidentally, I started reading Dennett's new book on religion last night and he drops James in a lot from the word go. James wrote the influential "Varieties of Religious Experience" which sounds v interesting. The book where he talks about the Multiverse is "A Pluralistic Universe" IIRC. Haven't read him but might do soon!

                        Oh yes, he was also Henry James's brother.

                        (My thanks go out to the creators of Google, as so often they do.)

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          This is an old subject by-line, I just stumbled on it and thought I would throw out a few cents, even if the subject might be mute at present.

                          As I understand It .... ... .. .

                          Multiple trademarks can be issued for and be in effect for the same word phrase, but in different realms of product. ie: Multiverse (condoms), Multiverse (poetry publishers Damn thats a good one...I should use that) Multiverse ( V shaped ass covers )

                          At present the US Trademark database, does not show a trademark for Wotc on the word "Multiverse". But does show 3 existing live trademarks using the word, 2 in the computer gadget conectivity genres, and one in Aerospace.

                          . .. ... ....But hell if I know.

                          "Bring Lawyers Guns and Money"

                          L.I.B

                          (edit add : Wotc hold a trademark for "Multiverse gift Box")
                          Last edited by Lord_In_Black; 03-30-2007, 06:29 PM. Reason: More Information became available to me ! so there !

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            I suppose I could trademark 'multiverse' in certain areas, but somehow it seems vaguely tacky to do that, especially since William James first introduced the word into English. Admittedly, I didn't know about his invention of the neologism at the time, but if William James didn't want to trademark the term, I don't think I'd want to!

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