Is MM's back cat. OOP in the UK & if so are reprints likely?

[Chief Wiggum]

Apologies if this has been raised elsewhere, I had a look but couldn't see anything.

As the title say really, are Mike's books Out of Print in the UK and if so does anyone know of any plans to reprint at any stage?

I picked up The Dreamthief's Daughter recently and really enjoyed it, having not really read much of Mike's stuff for probably 10 years or so (more because it doesn't seem to be readily available in the UK, so when I go to buy books I can only buy what's available naturally ).

I like to buy new books rather than 2nd hand, as I don't particularly want dog eared copies off Ebay!

Even large online booksellers (such as Amazon) don't have much for sale that isn't 2nd hand.

I'd really like the 15 Omnibus versions of Tale of the Eternal Champion, but currently only have about 8 of the Millenium prints from the early 90s, then the rest of the books in the Reading List, again I only have a few of the other books so have a few gaps to fill.

Obviously if the films gets off the ground they'll be everywhere :clap:

[Anonymous]

As far as I know there's a lot of my books in print in the UK. Just checking Amazon seems to suggest that many are still in print.
However, it is true that I'm letting stuff go out of print for the moment
and am trying to get rights sorted out with Orion/VG with whom I'm having something of a dispute. As I understand it, however, many can be ordered through regular bookshops or through Amazon, including the other two Elric books which follow The Dreamthief's Daughter. Friends report that quite a few titles are commonly available in London shops.

[Chief Wiggum]

Thanks very much for the reply.

I confess I hadn't really looked into trying to source copies outside the UK (due to postage costs mainly) nor thought about seeing if a bookstore could order them. I might try the latter route initially.

I live in the Greater Manchester area and unfortunately there isn't a huge amount available in shops here.

As you mention a search of Amazon UK does bring up a lot of your books (over 600 in fact) but a lot of those are via their marketplace (their EBay equivalent I think) and are 2nd hand.

I'll have to spend a bit more time at the weekend to see if I can fill the gaps :)

Regardless, I hope you can sort the rights out over here, it would be good to see some of your books on the shelves again, I'm sure Tolkien wouldn't have minded giving up a shelf or two of the LotR bookcase that every bookshop over here seems to have at the moment :)

[Michael Moorcock]

Yeah, the days are gone when Tolkien and I were about the only fantasy names on the W.H.Smith shelves! Me and Bovril have lost the brand wars, it seems... Waterstones in Central Manchester does, I'm told, have quite a few titles. Elsewhere, you're right, it's pretty much Tolkien and Marmite all over.

[Chief Wiggum]

Maybe a joint promotion with Bovril could revive both your fortunes over here?

Not entirely sure how that would work (or that I'd benefit being a veggie) but someone does need to do something about Marmite ( it's gross ).

[Michael Moorcock]

Well, Marmite originally came out as a vegetarian answer to Bovril and then Bovril, in desperation, tried to go vegetarian in recent years, but has failed to beat the Marmite brand. As someone who's fond of Marmite and is married to an American actually addicted to the stuff, I can't agree with your dislike. A little of it does go a long way, after all. And what else could you do with the scrapings from beer vats ? I'm sorry to see Bovril go because it's one of the few old brands derived from an sf novel. In
The Coming Race by Bulwer Lytton he had the beings of the future living on something called Vrill, a sort of all-purpose superfood. A manufacturer brought the stuff out and Bulwer Lytton threatened to sue, so they added the Bo (from Bovine, since it was a beef extract) and thus Bovril came to dominate the larders of the 19th century. The 21st, sadly, will be an all-Marmite century. Vegamite, in my view, is a sad substitute.
Though saying this has caused threats of serious bodily harm from Australians...
It's interesting how some 'brands' do come to dominate the literary field as well as the supermarket shelves. Harry Potter has done it most recently, I suppose. No better or worse than many other children's fantasy books, it has become a recogniseable and safe brand bought by many who actually buy no other books.
I was once warned by my publisher that I shouldn't mess with my own brand and keep writing all this other stuff (i.e. other than 'straight' fantasy books like Hawkmoon and so on) or I would lose my market share. I'd heard other arguments ever since I got into publishing, being told that magazines or books were 'just like baked beans' and refuse that logic, just as I refused to write fantasy books under one name and literary books under another, since it had always been my hope to reunite popular and literary fiction from my earliest days, even before I started editing New Worlds, and it would have contradicted that intention by buying into the baked bean logic..
I think it's probably tougher to do it the way I've done it, but ultimately you keep a readership, even if you lose some of the mass market along the way. I think I'd rather have the kind of readers I have now since, happily, books are NOT ultimately like baked beans or even beef extracts even though they will sometimes seem to obey similar market forces.
Bulwer Lytton might not be the greatest writer in the universe, but The Coming Race occasionally gets reprinted still, so will ultimately outlast its originally more successful pot of goo!

[Chief Wiggum]

I never expected to learn the origins of Bovril's name as well as the availability of your books when I started this thread :)
Although, I'm now in a strong position should any Bovril related questions come up on Trivial Pursuits next time I play, there must be some (though I'm still irked by the last time I played and lost because the opponenets last question was who invented the Kenwood mixer, I've heard of the answer being in the question but still!)

I agree with the comment re. Harry Potter and brand domination. If you go to any bookstore over here the Children's section is dominated by Harry Potter, the Fanatsay by Lord of the Rings and so on.

Although, to be fair, in this day and age there's something to be said for books that encourage kids to read.

[Michael Moorcock]

I'm never entirely sure of the 'it gets kids reading' argument, which goes back quite a way to explain popular phenomena. My best friend from childhood, for instance, only read the Harry Potter of his day -- the William books of Richmal Crompton. He read William and that was it. There are also people who only read, say, John Grisham. I used to think that the reason people thought James Bond books were so good was because they had never read a book before they read James Bond (another example of brand domination). I mean how many people who started on Marmite went on to try Bovril ? Clearly not enough. :)

[johneffay]

I have been told that the 'Harry Potter gets kids reading' argument is fallacious, in that a large percentage of sales are generated by adults. Whilst kids certainly are reading Potter, the claim is that these are the kids who are regular readers anyway. In other words, the 'Harry Potter phenomenon' is that a large percentage of the reading population read the books, not that people are being encouraged to read by the books.

Apparently, this can be extrapolated from the sales demographic/figures. I've not seen the details though.

[Chief Wiggum]

Ah, fair enough, those points make sense.

They never really had anything like Harry Potter when I was younger, I read quite a bit about some albino with a big sword instead

I assume the opposite to my point is happening in a way then, as Mike mentions below.
As such a large percentage of the reading poulation are reading Harry Potter it'd be interesting to know exactly what impact that's having on other authors, assuming that people aren't really experimenting other authors and just sticking with what they know and like.

[Pellaz]

If kids don't go out and pick up books by other Young Adult authors*, it won't be the publishers' and bookstores' faults in the States, that's for sure. Upon walking into a Borders or Barnes & Noble store over here, you can't help but stumble over the Young Adult book displays, often tagged with "If you enjoyed Harry Potter, try...."

A friend who works at B&N told me that some of the other YA series have been selling fairly well, but only time will tell for sure if kids really are reading more. Quick, have your publishers put out a YA edition of Elric!**

Rowling and Tolkien sales continue to influence British publishers' selection of new fantasy (i.e., not enough new writers). Storm Constantine tried to get more new writers in print through her own Immanion Press line, but she's now told me sadly that she's going to have to give it up, and just reprint back-catalog books from esablished British writers whose works are now OOP, plus the Wraeththu Mythos books. :(



==---==---
* although the most recent Harry Potter book really can't be classed as a YA novel, in my opinion

** I was joking, but y'know, this might not be such a bad idea after all...just have 'happy' book covers or something :)

[Michael Moorcock]

Yes, it's possible to argue that Tolkien and Rowling have a market share which actually works against original books being published. This isn't their fault, of course, though maybe Rowling could do something about it by doing what I'd do if I had her dosh -- starting a publishing company to publish new, original work! After all, it would probably be a tax loss for her, if sales of new and original work are anything to go by, these days!
The economic constitution of publishing and book-selling do tend to work against genuinely original work being done. It was bad enough when we were publishing New Worlds, though there was a less conservative readership out there in the 60s, in my experience, but now it's worse than ever. The only people who seem to continue steadfastly going against the trend are firms like Savoy who are not publishing for profit but for pleasure and a need to see work they like being made available to the public. I'm still inclined to blame the stock market for much of what goes on. Many a senior editor of my acquaintance has been asked at shareholder meetings why they can't 'just publish bestsellers'. By that logic, of course, neither LOTR or HP would ever have seen the light of day. Someone should have the guts to get up at a meeting and tell the shareholders that by doing only clones of bestsellers they are actually working against the shareholders' interest.

[Keele]

I have been told that the 'Harry Potter gets kids reading' argument is fallacious, in that a large percentage of sales are generated by adults. Whilst kids certainly are reading Potter, the claim is that these are the kids who are regular readers anyway. In other words, the 'Harry Potter phenomenon' is that a large percentage of the reading population read the books, not that people are being encouraged to read by the books.

I started reading the first Harry Potter book less than a year after it came out (I was almost twelve at the time I think), but I was already a "well-established" reader: I'd read Tolkien a few years prior to discovering Rowling, for example. Have you ever read Harold Bloom's criticism of Harry Potter? I don't totally agree with Bloom, but his article addresses the argument about getting kids to read.

http://wrt-brooke.syr.edu/courses/205.03/bloom.html

[Chief Wiggum]

The economic constitution of publishing and book-selling do tend to work against genuinely original work being done. It was bad enough when we were publishing New Worlds, though there was a less conservative readership out there in the 60s, in my experience, but now it's worse than ever. The only people who seem to continue steadfastly going against the trend are firms like Savoy who are not publishing for profit but for pleasure and a need to see work they like being made available to the public. I'm still inclined to blame the stock market for much of what goes on. Many a senior editor of my acquaintance has been asked at shareholder meetings why they can't 'just publish bestsellers'.

I know nothing about book publishing, how profitable it is/isn't and how payments to the authors work.

However, (and this is where my ignorance will no doubt be evident :)) when a film or video game for example can cost millions (tens or hundreds of even) I do slightly understand why so few risks are taken (not that I like it). But aren't the inital publishing costs for books a lot lower than this, meaning that a publisher could take more risks (and who knows find the next HP and make a bundle). Or is it that the publisher is concerned with what retailers will actually stiock?

[Mikey_C]

The true genius is whoever succeeded in persuading adults that they wanted to read JKR. A second fairytale was made up to tell about her life in the glossies - poor impoverished single mum scribbling away in an Edinburgh cafe because she couldn't afford to heat her flat, when actually she was well-heeled all along and the "cafe" was her brother's posh restaurant! That's not literature, that's shifting units.