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Gloriana ending change

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  • The English Assassin
    replied
    Originally posted by David Mosley View Post
    'Salلmbo', 1921 by A.H. Tanoux.

    (That cover was actually the very first one I ever uploaded to the Image Hive (né Gallery) over at the old MWM site. Never judge a book by its cover they say, but with a cover like that who needs content? )
    Seems like the only place to find anything on this pic on the web is on this site. I tried Google and three other search engines with no luck! Indeed there's not much on the artist at all! Aw well, at least you did a great job of uploading the book image.

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  • David Mosley
    replied
    'Salلmbo', 1921 by A.H. Tanoux.

    (That cover was actually the very first one I ever uploaded to the Image Hive (né Gallery) over at the old MWM site. Never judge a book by its cover they say, but with a cover like that who needs content? )

    ETA: Tanoux's complete painting:
    Last edited by David Mosley; 08-08-2011, 10:26 AM. Reason: Added image of full painting of Tanoux's 'Salلmbo'.

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  • Michael Moorcock
    replied
    credit shd be on the book
    i hd the whole picture somewhere

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  • The English Assassin
    replied
    Originally posted by Michael Moorcock View Post
    The Warner edition has both endngs. I, too, love that early cover -- but the whole painting. I was upset that they cut her at the torso, emphasing gender characteristics. The whole paintng was my choice as a proposed wrap-around. If it's the one I'm thinking of, it's at the Royal Shakespeare Theatre, Stratford.
    I actually might have to go and have a look at it myself sometime, as it looks great. I'd like to see the full picture but Google isn't being forthcoming!

    I cant believe some of the decisions publishers make with novels, both with text changes and mucking around with cover art. Strolling through Waterstones the other day, I was struck by the blandness of the covers. They all had that genric Dan Brown clone or generic chic-lit look to them. It's time for some originality again.

    Leave a comment:


  • Michael Moorcock
    replied
    The Warner edition has both endngs. I, too, love that early cover -- but the whole painting. I was upset that they cut her at the torso, emphasing gender characteristics. The whole paintng was my choice as a proposed wrap-around. If it's the one I'm thinking of, it's at the Royal Shakespeare Theatre, Stratford.

    Leave a comment:


  • Pietro_Mercurios
    replied
    Here's the front cover of my 2001 ed. Fantasy Masterworks copy of Gloriana:



    Copyright © Michael Moorcock, 1978, 1993

    ...

    Author's Note

    ...

    This edition is significantly
    revised from all previous English language
    editions.
    Last edited by Pietro_Mercurios; 02-16-2007, 02:17 PM.

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  • johneffay
    replied
    Originally posted by David Mosley View Post
    I'm not sure whether the Fantasy Masterworks edition has the original Chapter 34 or the revised.
    I'm fairly sure it has the revised, as I believe that was the edition I read the ending of in Borders to see what the difference is.

    Leave a comment:


  • The English Assassin
    replied
    Originally posted by David Mosley View Post
    The 1993 paperback from Phoenix was the first revised edition.

    I'm not sure whether the Fantasy Masterworks edition has the original Chapter 34 or the revised.

    Finally, the 2004 US edition from Warner Aspect contains both versions.

    (Which reminds me I really ought to see about getting a copy of that edition.)
    Cheers David, I'll have to keep my eyes peeled for the updated version.



    It's a pity that this edition doesn't have the new text as thats a beautiful cover!

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  • David Mosley
    replied
    People can always use the and buttons when they post to hide (mask) anything that might be considered a Spoiler.

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  • The English Assassin
    replied
    Originally posted by Idiot_Savant View Post
    Thanks alot for ruining it for me! Gloriana is one of the few of Michael's books I have not had the pleasure of reading yet. I should have known better than to venture into this thread since I try to avoid any discussion of Gloriana.



    Bad Liz bad bad Liz
    Oh dear!

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  • Idiot_Savant
    replied
    Thanks alot for ruining it for me! Gloriana is one of the few of Michael's books I have not had the pleasure of reading yet. I should have known better than to venture into this thread since I try to avoid any discussion of Gloriana.



    Bad Liz bad bad Liz

    Leave a comment:


  • David Mosley
    replied
    The 1993 paperback from Phoenix was the first revised edition.


    I'm not sure whether the Fantasy Masterworks edition has the original Chapter 34 or the revised.
    [ETA: It has the revised version.]


    Finally, the 2004 US edition from Warner Aspect contains both versions.


    (Which reminds me I really ought to see about getting a copy of that edition.)
    Last edited by David Mosley; 08-08-2011, 10:03 AM.

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  • The English Assassin
    replied
    Hmmm... hell of a long time ago when I read Gloriana (it was the Avon 1979 edition). Can't say I remember for sure what ending it had, but the rape kind of sounds familiar. I've been meaning to re-read it for sometime (at the mo it's in storage, but I should be gain access to it again soon). Out of interest which edition marks the change in text?

    Leave a comment:


  • Michael Moorcock
    replied
    You're dead on about Gloriana, but it wasnt public outcry made me change it, just my own thinking about it. I was upset that John Clute in the SF Encyclopedia ascribed my changes to some sort of knee-jerk 'feminism'. That wasn't the case. I did want Gloriana to start thinking of herself, rather than of herself as 'the State' and I needed some way of offering her release, but I'd never been entirely happy with the original end. No point in saying 'women don't like this or don't like that' -- different women have different views. I just wasn't happy with the implications, as you say, so changed it to give what I thought was a better, clearer message.

    Leave a comment:


  • manmiles
    started a topic Gloriana ending change

    Gloriana ending change

    I recently finished reading Gloriana. My copy is an early edition with the rape scene intact, I also checked out the newer edition from a library with the new ending.

    Was there a lot of controversy concerning the original ending? Did you recieve complaints about justifying rape or making rape seem like the only way woman achieve true pleasure.

    Films recently released on DVD in England from the Video Nasties period such as Straw Dogs garnered a lot of infamous press when the film seemed to imply the 'No as Yes' aspect with a rather ambiguous rape scene.

    In terms of Gloriana's ending. I do feel that the rape is a rather cheap and nasty coda since it never felt like Gloriana's inability to orgasm was a huge part of the plot and seems to serve only as an end to the Gloriana/Quire relationship. Whereas in my reading of the new ending, Gloriana achieves orgasm when she starts to assert her own strength of will after years of being pretty much commanded around by Montfallacon. This may be totally wrong, but that was how I read it. She has lost all who have support her and basically thought for her and when she has to stand on her own, she embraces womanhood and thus achieves orgasm.

    And for the record, I think that if Straw Dogs wasn't banned, it would just be 'another film' instead of the infamously banned title it has become. Didn't think too much of it, the basic metaphor seemed to be, 'if you're a smart and educated guy, other people will push you about until you jam their head in a bear trap.' :D I hate watching films and reading books which the majority proclaim a classic because if I don't like it...am I a bad person? I mean, I like 'A Catcher in the Rye,' but I wouldn't put it down as the most groundbreaking work of fiction people declare it to be.
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